We generally use the layered approach as well, with overloads declared when individual weapons are.
A: "Offensive Fire Phase. I'm not firing."
B: "Well I am."
A: "In that case, I will too."
B: "I'm going to fire 4 phaser-1s and four torpedoes, two of them partially overloaded, all at your D6."
A: "I'm firing 6 phaser-2s and 4 standard disruptors at your CA."
B: "OK. Do you want to roll first?"
The "Me too" rule: 1E4
Moderators: mjwest, Albiegamer
Firing overloads or not is all part of the bidding process. When you declare fire for a weapon you must declare if it is overloaded or not. If it is not you can still overload it later in the bidding process, but once declared as an overload you can not take it back.
Example:
F: "I'm firing 4 phaeser ones"
K: "ok, then I will fire 4 disrupters and 3 phaser ones:
F: "I will add 4 standard photons then"
K: "Then I better overload 3 of my disrupters and add 2 phaser twos"
F: "Then I will fully overload 2 photons and partially overload one other photon"
then the dice are rolled.
Example:
F: "I'm firing 4 phaeser ones"
K: "ok, then I will fire 4 disrupters and 3 phaser ones:
F: "I will add 4 standard photons then"
K: "Then I better overload 3 of my disrupters and add 2 phaser twos"
F: "Then I will fully overload 2 photons and partially overload one other photon"
then the dice are rolled.
No, you can have them as standard loads and overload them at the instant of firing.Hod K'el wrote:Then you have six Photon torpedoes (sp?) firing since you must start the turn with the photons overloaded or not. You can not overload a photon mid-stream.
Though now I suppose we're getting into what exactly the "instant of firing" actually is.
Reading the rule on firing, I'm not seeing a clear interpretation one way or the other. Allowing the constant "oneupmanship" dialog does seem most to be in the spirit of "me too" firing, with the normal requirement that you can't "back out" of any commitment (i.e., once overloaded it must be fired as such).
The point I was getting at was that a player should not be able to declare that his photons/disruptors are overloaded after the dice have started rolling.
I believe the "one-upping" from standard load to overload can occur during the fire declaration process.
For example, Joe says, "I'm firing 2 photons."
Fred says, "I'm firing 3 Ph-1s."
Joe then says, "I'm overloading those 2 photons."
But, if Joe does not declare he is overloading those 2 photons and the dice begin to roll, he cannot later say, "Oh, by the way, I'm overloading my 2 photons." That would not give other players a chance to change their firing orders.
Now if Joe had already paid for those photons to be overloaded, then that is what they are. His ship card is available to anyone's inspection to see that they are overloaded.
I believe the "one-upping" from standard load to overload can occur during the fire declaration process.
For example, Joe says, "I'm firing 2 photons."
Fred says, "I'm firing 3 Ph-1s."
Joe then says, "I'm overloading those 2 photons."
But, if Joe does not declare he is overloading those 2 photons and the dice begin to roll, he cannot later say, "Oh, by the way, I'm overloading my 2 photons." That would not give other players a chance to change their firing orders.
Now if Joe had already paid for those photons to be overloaded, then that is what they are. His ship card is available to anyone's inspection to see that they are overloaded.
Mike
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Sandpaper gets the job done, but makes for a lot of friction.
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Sandpaper gets the job done, but makes for a lot of friction.
Just to be clear, you should only fire what you have declared, and all declaration must occur prior to rolling any dice. A weapon not declared as overloaded* is assumed to be a normal load.
Overloading of photons is a very flexible thing (aside from requiring gobs of energy). They may be added at the end of the first turn of arming, at the beginning or end of the second turn of arming (or any turn they are held), or at the instant of firing (which would then work like overloading disruptors, which must always be done at the instant of firing).
"Instant of firing" means during the declaration process. So, for a disruptor, you will declare it as either a normal load or overload. Then, when resolving the fire, you pay the energy and roll the die/dice. For a normally loaded photon, the same thing. You declare that it remains a normal load, or that you are overloading at that point (either with +2 or +4). Then, when resolving the fire, you pay the energy and roll the die/dice.
I hope that helps.
[*] The noteworthy exception, of course, is for a photon that has already been overloaded. If the photon has been fully overloaded to +4, then you don't need to explicitly state that it is overloaded as that is already known information. Now, if it is partially overloaded to +2, you will need to declare if you are adding any more energy to make it +4.
Overloading of photons is a very flexible thing (aside from requiring gobs of energy). They may be added at the end of the first turn of arming, at the beginning or end of the second turn of arming (or any turn they are held), or at the instant of firing (which would then work like overloading disruptors, which must always be done at the instant of firing).
"Instant of firing" means during the declaration process. So, for a disruptor, you will declare it as either a normal load or overload. Then, when resolving the fire, you pay the energy and roll the die/dice. For a normally loaded photon, the same thing. You declare that it remains a normal load, or that you are overloading at that point (either with +2 or +4). Then, when resolving the fire, you pay the energy and roll the die/dice.
I hope that helps.
[*] The noteworthy exception, of course, is for a photon that has already been overloaded. If the photon has been fully overloaded to +4, then you don't need to explicitly state that it is overloaded as that is already known information. Now, if it is partially overloaded to +2, you will need to declare if you are adding any more energy to make it +4.
Federation Commander Answer Guy
Thanks Mike. But does that mean that you can overload your previously normal-load] photon, or your disruptor, as part of the 'Me, too' system?
For example,
Fed: 'I'm firing Photon A at your ship'
Klink: 'I'm firing Disruptor A at your ship, and I'm overloading it.'
Fed: 'Oh, ok then, in that case that Photon A is also overloaded by +4'
Would it be legal for the Fed to do that?
For example,
Fed: 'I'm firing Photon A at your ship'
Klink: 'I'm firing Disruptor A at your ship, and I'm overloading it.'
Fed: 'Oh, ok then, in that case that Photon A is also overloaded by +4'
Would it be legal for the Fed to do that?
