Federation Commander

[djdood]

^^^ What Dal said.

Totally interchangeable. I would highly recommend the CC mini over the CA. It looks far better.

My understanding is that the Starline minis have been produced in pewter for many years now. After the "They're toys! Kids will eat them!!" scare died down, there was a flirtation with the P90 lead alloy, but it came to nothing.
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[Itharus]

Well, I'll pick up a Federation Command Cruiser then for my first go. 'Cuz everyone's first mini should be one

Silly question: I can use paint thinner to completely strip the model if I mess up, without damaging the pewter, right?

[phdillman]

Heck, to strip pewter, I've gone as far as to using brake fluid. just remember to completely scrub and dry the mini. I usually let them dry over night.

[Scoutdad]

There are several things that can be used... many of them are a bit dangerous, so YMMV.

I currently use Easy OFF! oven cleaner. I have an old stainless steel bowl found at a yard sale. Place the minis (pewter one... not plastic or resin!) in the bowl...
Take it outside... repeat... TAKE IT OUTSIDE!
Liberally (or conservatively if from Texas) cover with the Easy-OFF!
Then I place it in the garage overnight.
The next day... every thing can be washed away with warm water and Dawn detergent. An old toothbrush helps with anything that might be stubborn or caught in a crevice.

I've also used brake fluid... as Patrick does.

I used to use MEK (Methyl-Ethyl Ketone) because I had a bit of it remaining.
But that stuff is waaaay dangerous and as the kids began to toddle, it was removed from the house.

I've also used paint stripper from Walmart, and a few other things.

The big thing to remember though is just what Patrick said, "Wash the mini well with soap and water after stripping. Regardless of the means / methods used to strip paint.
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Commander, Battlegroup Murfreesboro
Department Head, ACTASF

[mjwest]

[Itharus]

Thanks for the advice. Will do

[djdood]

+1 to the above. Safety first.

In the interest of reducing my fumes exposure, I switched to using Simple Green for most stripping, a while back.

Simple Green is a concentrated pine-based liquid soap. Undiluted, it is chemically powerful enough to soften and strip many paints (especially when they have been applied recently).

Because it's "just soap" it's a lot less nasty and easier to dispose of the waste afterwards. Of course it is highly *concentrated* and powerful soap, so proper eye protection is still a must, rubber gloves are a very good idea, and proper ventilation will help avoid throat and sinus irritation.

For jobs Simple Green can't handle, my escalation go-to is Easy Off. I've not yet had to go to anything stronger (like brake cleaner). Again, Eye-protection mandatory, gloves a must with this caustic stuff, and proper ventilation also a must. This stuff will damage your airway, if you let it.

Once the paint has become loose (it will bubble and pucker up, often in big sheets), then it can be stripped off with an old toothbrush. Particularly tenacious bits can be picked out with toothpicks or soaked again.

Pewter and lead minis are essentially immune to any of the above (they might pick up a harmless patina to the metal, but that's all).

Plastic minis (like the "Zochi plastic" Feds in Squadron Box #91) need some extra attention. Simple Green will not harm them. Easy Off could, if left for too long, so check them every couple of hours and remove them as soon as the paint has come loose. I've heard brake cleaner won't harm them, but I've also heard it will - I would not trust it unsupervised.

Solvent paint thinner (especially turpentine) is a bad idea on plastic, almost guaranteed to damage it, but can't do anything to metals.
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[Itharus]

Good to know on the Simple Green. That's the nice thing about metal models - you can mess up the paint job, clean up the mini, and repeat Although I could never bring myself to do that... my first few minis (truly awful paint jobs) I kept for the longest time, lol, badge of honor sort of thing I guess.

One last question though - the water slide decals - do those go on before or after you seal a mini with a finishing coat? The times I've used decals I never actually sealed the mini - that's only something I started doing at the very end of my WH40K days back around 2000 or so. But I know there is 0 chance of me painting in the NCC stuff freehand and having it look good, so I'll need to hit the decals.

[djdood]

It depends on what paint you use.

Decals need a totally smooth surface to prevent "silvering", which is zillions of tiny air pockets under the decal. If you apply a waterslide decal over a matte or (especially) a flat base coat of paint, they will misbehave - to get the lack of reflectivity those kinds of paints exhibit, they have a degree of "tooth" and texture to them, which is exactly what decals don't want..

However, a gloss coat of paint is totally fine and is exactly what I do for my minis. The decals adhere well.

If you need to paint the mini in a flat or matte (perhaps because a perfect bottle color is only available that way), you can seal the mini with a clear gloss (such as Krystal Klear) or even an airbrushed coat of thinned Future acrylic floor polish. This would give the mini the gloss coat the decals need to perform well.

Once all detailing, decal application, weathering, etc. is done, the mini should get a final seal coat of clear to lock them in and protect them from handling. I highly recommend using a flat or matte clear coat for this final seal coat, to mitigate the "toy" look a shiny clear coat gives.
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[Scoutdad]

Will:
Easy-OFF! will indeed soften the plastic 'Zocchi' minis.
I have a few I intentionally over-soaked to allow me to deform them in ways that pewter cannot be twisted.
I concur with your brake fluid statement... I've heard both version (will damage / wont damage)... so for my money, I assume it will.

Mike: Too true.
Many years ago when I was young, dumb, and invincible - I didn't pay as close attention to safety as I should... doing things like priming in the house... using Methyl Ethyl Ketone and Lacquer Thinner to strip paint, etc.
Now... it's totally different (funny what having kids does to your outlook on the future...) I prime outside... or in the garage with a vacuum aided spray booth at least. Stripping is only done outdoors with Easy-OFF!... etc.
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Commander, Battlegroup Murfreesboro
Department Head, ACTASF

[Scoutdad]

Back on the subject of minis and stripping / decaling:

Check your local bargain store. I picked up a battery powered toothbrush for $1.99. That makes it super easy to remove any traces of stubborn paint after the chemical stripping process.

And as for decaling. +1,000 for Will's comments.
I use matte paints exclusively, on every miniature...whether it's a car, space ship, monster, or character.
Once painting is done... I hit it with a light coat of gloss sealer to provide a smooth surface for decals.
Weathering, if any - is applied after the decals. Nothing looks more unrealistic than a well-worn and weathered miniature sporting brand new, bright shiny decals and marking...
Then, after everything else is done - I apply two light coats of a matte finish to get rid of the sheen. Two (or even three) light coats will prevent chipping / scratching during most normal game play and is less likely to yellow / frost than one thick gloppy coat. And yes, 'Gloppy' is the correct term!
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Commander, Battlegroup Murfreesboro
Department Head, ACTASF

[Itharus]

What's weathering, exactly? Not something I've done before.

[Scoutdad]

[Itharus]

Ahhh. I gotcha now... I used to do layered inkings for gore on my 40K mini's weapons. Although usually if I wanted battle damage I just attacked the mini with an exacto knife before painting XD

I wanted to run this past some people: for the nacelle tips, I was considering painting them brass, possibly with either some lighter or darker flecks, then using a rather blood-colored red ink, thinly, but multiple coats over the brass. I'm hoping for a sort of pseudo-metallic red, kind of shiny effect. You guys think this would work? If no one has a clue, I'll just give it a shot and hope for the best.

[djdood]

Can't speak to the nacelle dome painting, as I use a completely different technique on mine.

Regarding weathering -
The original filming model of the Enterprise had some subtle weathering applied to it and that kind of set the direction many folks go.

As Tony noted, the weathering helps to provide some additional sense of scale, making the mini look less toy-like. Don't think of it only in terms of battle damage or very dirtied-down ships (like in Star Wars films). Subtle weathering is more scale-appropriate on these tiny figures..



On this mini, I used some pastels to apply the "rust ring" on the saucer (just forward of the registry numbers), some shadowing around the bridge B/C deck teardrop, some indication of paneling on the engines, and (using white pastels) some highlights to various high spots. The camera flash washed a lot of it out; it has more contrast in-person.
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